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Here's round two...
She loves my writing - but then she comes into my room and says I shouldn't use words like "cock" and "spunk" - that it belittles the eroticism of the scenes.
Sighhhh....
Then she said that I go into too much detail about body positioning...sigh.
I tried to tell her that her thought on the use of the word "cock" were her own opinion - that it's a personal reaction and a generational thing too. She equates the word with being vulgar and a slap in the face to men and the readers - like it's the male version of "cunt." See - offensive....
I told her that that's not how all others see it. That since I'm writing about sex between two gay men - the use of cock is appropriate. That it is meant to be erotic - hot - etc. Naughty in a good way.
I asked well, come on - it's hard enough to write sex between two men and get all the "his" "he", etc - straight - meaning who's doing what to whom. Now try adding in telling whose penis is whose.... It's a mind field. How many times can you reference it with cock, dick, hardon, sex, etc... And not be a broken record?
Course then she told me dick and hardon aren't good either.
Awwwww....
As for the details I go into... Damn it - I'm trying to do that. It's to help with the visuals. I want the reader to experience it with them.
Ok - so I told her we just disagree. But she needs to view it from how I intended it, not necessarily how she personally reacts. Does that make any sense?
She's reading the second chapter to "Not Letting Go" btw - the opening bathtub scene between Stuart/Vince.
So - she loves my writing and the story - thinks it holds value - but that one thing seems to have caught her focus...sigh.
It has me thinking.... What are your own opinions about the sex scenes we read in slash? Are they realistically done? Do you think gay men see them as realistic? Have you ever asked? lol....
I just... I don't know. I'm glad we're having discussions about this. I'm glad she likes the writing. But these convo's are also frustrating....
xof
She loves my writing - but then she comes into my room and says I shouldn't use words like "cock" and "spunk" - that it belittles the eroticism of the scenes.
Sighhhh....
Then she said that I go into too much detail about body positioning...sigh.
I tried to tell her that her thought on the use of the word "cock" were her own opinion - that it's a personal reaction and a generational thing too. She equates the word with being vulgar and a slap in the face to men and the readers - like it's the male version of "cunt." See - offensive....
I told her that that's not how all others see it. That since I'm writing about sex between two gay men - the use of cock is appropriate. That it is meant to be erotic - hot - etc. Naughty in a good way.
I asked well, come on - it's hard enough to write sex between two men and get all the "his" "he", etc - straight - meaning who's doing what to whom. Now try adding in telling whose penis is whose.... It's a mind field. How many times can you reference it with cock, dick, hardon, sex, etc... And not be a broken record?
Course then she told me dick and hardon aren't good either.
Awwwww....
As for the details I go into... Damn it - I'm trying to do that. It's to help with the visuals. I want the reader to experience it with them.
Ok - so I told her we just disagree. But she needs to view it from how I intended it, not necessarily how she personally reacts. Does that make any sense?
She's reading the second chapter to "Not Letting Go" btw - the opening bathtub scene between Stuart/Vince.
So - she loves my writing and the story - thinks it holds value - but that one thing seems to have caught her focus...sigh.
It has me thinking.... What are your own opinions about the sex scenes we read in slash? Are they realistically done? Do you think gay men see them as realistic? Have you ever asked? lol....
I just... I don't know. I'm glad we're having discussions about this. I'm glad she likes the writing. But these convo's are also frustrating....
xof
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From:
no subject
Well, in QaF unless you are writing hetero sex you aren't writing slash. These guys really are gay.
In terms of quality of writing, it's all over the place. Some people, such as yourself and many other writers write really wonderful stuff. Some people ought to be banned from ever setting pen to paper (or finger to keyboard) ever again. You can't really generalize.
Now, has your mother seen QaF? If so her objections don't really hold a lot of weight. Those are the words the boys use. If you want things to be realistic then those are the terms you need to use. When guys (straight or gay) talk about sex they use the words cock, dick, cum etc. If you use medically correct terminology you lose the feel of the genre.
From:
no subject
See, I have a problem with that statement. I know that some people believe that 'slash' deals only with subtextual pairings.
But.. if it's not slash, what is it?
Because it's not het. Het is male/female only. And it's not gen. Gen involves no sex what-so-ever.
Give me a better term that everyone knows, and I'll use it. Until then, even if they're gay in canon, it's slash to me.
From:
no subject
if it's not slash, what is it?
It's just fanfic. It's sex, if your story has sex in it. It isn't slash sex because these characters really do have sex with each other (or they could have in the case of non-canon couples.) Otherwise it's just fanfic.
I don't watch any other shows so I'll make something up (I really don't know any other characters.) Suppose you watch ER. There is a het couple on the show, say Dr. Mary and Dr. Bob. You write fanfic about Dr. Mary and Dr. Bob. That's not slash, it's fanfic. So how is it different writing about Brian and Justin, or Stuart and Nathan (or Vince since as far as I'm concerned they were lovers at the end.)? Just because they are gay fic about them has to be called slash?
Now, if you wrote a fic about Dr. Mary and Dr. Jane, that would be slash, it's a sexual orientation outside canon. Same if you wrote about Brian and Cynthia, or Nathan and Donna. That would be slash.
Just my opinion of course.
From:
no subject
I think we might be coming from a different definition of slash here. To me (and to much, if not most, of fandom), slash is male/male only. There is never male/female involved - male/female is never slash, regardless of whether it is a canon pairing or not. And female/female is femslash.
To me, it's simply a way of describing what you'll see inside. "This fic contains two men having sex, thus it is slash." "This fic contains a man and a woman having sex, thus it is het." "This fic contains two woman having sex, thus it is femslash."
I think we just have a problem of word defintion here.
From:
no subject
And, you and I have talked about this before--I personally prefer the word "dick" but can't use unless it's in character dialogue or pov and appropriate for the character to say. I use "cock" only because it IS, in fact, the "accepted" erotica word, as opposed to the various and sundry porn words.
That's my two cents. ::hugs::
From:
no subject
I doubt that it's truly realistic - i.e. a lot of slash has the infamous "1 finger 2 finger 3 finger go!" which is... not realistic.
Not to mention that apparently only about 40% of gay men actually have anal sex (I want to know who gets these statistics).
But then..
I don't think that any fictional sex scenes can be truly realistic. If they were, we wouldn't find them erotic. It's like watching porn, in a way - porn is almost never the way "real people" have sex.
Er... if that makes any sense.
From:
no subject
Excellent point. It's idealized isn't it?
From:
no subject
On how realistic sex scenes are, I have had discussions about this with some of my gay friends, and they dislike slash fic because they say the sex scenes are fake and the story lines are unrealistic. But then again, they don't read fanfic in general, so I think they're biased. I remember one of my friends dismissing it as "Gay sex as written by women, for women." Which, in general, it is.
I could ask him to be more specific about what he thinks is unrealistic about it.
From:
no subject
I could never let my mom read anything I wrote.... Mainly because even when your in the same room as her and you utter the word 'sex' she point and says "Shhhh!!". Hehe, but I think thats just coz Im her daughter... she doesn't do that to any of my friends.
Ohhh and I've shown my gay friends some of your QAF ficcies, along with some of Margo's... and I shall add that he says they are "Very hot and sexy and definately worth reading". But next time I talk to him I shall ask him if he thinks they are realistic or not. Thats a good question.
In my opinions for slashy sex, I think they are just... DRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL... yep, very good, very wonderful, very nice... sexy, hot, lovely, spectacular, yummy, fantastic.. etc. etc. *hearts everywhere*
-Vashley
From:
hehehe...
well by all means let me know what they say...
hugs
xof